The L.A. freeway system is not about L.A. It's about Southern California. Comments that suggest public transportation don't take into account the unique layout of SoCal. Here are just a few of the things to take into account, coming from a guy that grew up in NYC and now lives in SoCal.
--SoCal is not like NYC or SF where you can walk a few blocks and take a bus or a subway. SoCal blocks are incredibly large. I get in my car to go 2 blocks away, because those blocks are huge. Two of those SoCal blocks are like 6 of my old NYC blocks.
--SoCal is made up of many, many cities over a large, large area. There is no way to get from one corner of Fountain Valley, in a subdivision, to a job in Irvine (relatively close) where the office in an office park is no where near a bus stop. And that's just Fountain Valley to Irvine. This is definitely not an easy situation like covering Manhattan (a single, centralized destination where many of the jobs are.)
--There is no way to setup a workable network of busses/trains to mesh all the cities involved. What's the solution for Costa Mesa to El Segundo? Torrance to Burbank? West Covina to Anaheim? Newport Beach to Norwalk? And so on.
--The bus system we have usually covers a single city and maybe an adjacent city. Going to work for most folks involves going thru 7-10 cities. A simple commute from Costa Mesa to Manhattan Beach could involve going thru (winging it here from memory): Costa Mesa to Fountain Valley, to Huntington Beach, to Westminster, to Bellflower, to Long Beach...(catches breath since I'm not even half way there on the 405 Fwy) to Wilmington, to Carson, to Torrance, to Redondo Beach, to Lawndale, to Manhattan Beach. And you're only at the freeway exit -- now you need to get to the exact office location which means driving thru Manhattan Beach. Take a series of buses, if even possible at all, and you're looking at a 3 hours commute one way.
I would love to take public transportation. It's just not possible. I can't even walk to get lunch. In centrally planned Irvine, they put the housing in one area, the commercial offices in another and the retail commercial spots in another. Even when they are semi-adjacent, the blocks are huge. It would take 30 minutes to walk to the nearest strip mall to get a burger. It's 5 minutes by car.
It sucks, but it's not just an issue of freeways. It's how SoCal is designed.
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Edit: adding my solution ---> tax breaks for businesses that allow telecommuting. Keep us off the road and the problem goes away.
+higher quality of life
+less wear and tear on the cars
+less pollution
+less expenses on gas, eating out for lunch
+less maintenance on the roads
+less need for new buses/trains/employees to run them
+less congestion for those that need to be on the road
After reading all these (good) comments, I thought I'd go to SO now and try and pitch in and answer a question or two in my domain of expertise. You know...give back to the community. Be a part of the solution.
I found a question that could easily be answered and would be of value to users hitting this issue.
I could not stop laughing at how this confirms the insanity being discussed here.
"Questions asking us to recommend or find a book, tool, software library, tutorial or other off-site resource are off-topic for Stack Overflow as they tend to attract opinionated answers and spam..."
Yes. And 238 million people saw Dez Bryant catch that ball notwithstanding the NFL's rule-which-must-be-followed-to-the-letter-of-the-law.
Some guy, or woman, won't get their question answered that could have helped them. It was a reasonable question. And people are willing to help them. In some way, I suspect StackOverflow is incredibly proud they prevented that...but stuck to the letter of the law on their policy.
Retiring at 30 = being a boring person for your 40s, 50s, etc.
I think a better situation is to be financially secure by your 30s (be completely out of debt, pay off a mortgage, have money for children, etc.) and then have the ability to start companies or work freelance for the rest of your life rather than being a slave to the 9-to-5 grind.
I do like the concept of getting rich slowly and learning slowly. I would love to peruse multiple degrees (I already have two) just out of the love of learning and also meeting other lovers of knowledge.
I think you simply value the work environment much more than anyone that "retires" at 30, much similar to people that continue to work after winning a large lottery. And that's ok. For most people that want extremely early retirement, though, it is time to spend with family: Time to learn: time to experience. Not a lot of people acheive this, but that's the dream.
And there's a reason why Google is hiding or manipulating their numbers. They're poor. If they were good, you know darn well they'd be bragging about them. So they play tricks and games to try to hide that data.
It's called supply and demand. It's called life. Things change. The world doesn't revolve around families that "shouldn't be uprooted and have their lives thrown into disorder".
If those families wanted to be able to stay there permanently at a fixed rate of housing expenses, they should have purchased the property. Can't afford to buy? Then deal with the risks of renting.
Their desire for low rent that keeps them comfy and entails no inconveniences has no validity. That's just a wish. That's immature. This is not grade school and not everyone gets a trophy for simply showing up.
Reasonably regulated market where people are free to pursue economic opportunities but with oversight that protects the underclass and underprivileged?
We have a reasonably regulated market. What we don't have is a system where people get to live where they want to live without regards to what they can afford.
SF renters need to back up the U-Haul truck and find new places to live where they can afford it. They are not "entitled" to live in SF simply because they want to.
The problem is, you're asking people who've lived in a place for generations just to up and move because yuppies want easier access to bars and fancy coffee shops. Surely you can understand why this isn't so simple, I hope.
People who have roots are getting uprooted because they declined or couldn't get in on the sweet tech boom dollars. A lot of the locals are pissed.
I live in Brooklyn, and I live in a part of Brooklyn that really, if they figured out I worked in Tech, I wouldn't be shocked if they showed up with torches and pitchforks as a warning to others.
I understand the problem. I just don't give it any validity. The renters think their wishes and desires to live in a specific area are more important than other people who wish to live in that same area. It comes across as immature and whining.
It's not just renting. It's income as well. There are lots of folks whining about how others make more money and how that "isn't fair". It's a broad theme of people complaining and having a sense of entitlement.
you don't think it's unfair that a landlord can upend your life and make it complete hell just so they can get tenants who are willing to pay more?
This isn't about moving, this is about completely changing lives. How to get to work, who's in the neighborhood, what's the neighborhood flavor like... it's more than just "living in a specific area" it's about living life.
Income inequality is another issue all together. No, it's not fair that a fast food joint has the guys who flip burgers and run the cash register do all the work and get literally the least amount of money the business can legally give them. And yes, they could just go look for other jobs... if there were any. In a lot of places, there just isn't other work. For others, their particular field may have been decimated. A friend of mine was a bar certified lawyer in corporate finance. ... when he graduated in 2008.
Yeah. life isn't fair, and maybe part of it is roughing it. But another part of it is also recognizing that the system has been inadvertently rigged towards the relatively wealthy and hyper wealthy.
There's reasons why there are protests in the streets of the Bay Area, and tone deaf responses like this are one of them.
Fair enough. Then they can go to medical school. Or law school. Or be an accountant. Or an investment banker. They could take up the trades (electricians, plumbers, carpentry). Maybe help animals--be a Veterinarian. Work on the dark side...be a mortician. Be an airplane mechanic or a civil engineer. Dispense drugs...be a Pharmacist. Build bridges and buildings.
Something tells me they will find an excuse for why any and all of those options presented are not options to them. They are professional complainers.
I'm not sure if you're intentionally sidestepping my point or not.
We're always going to need people to do tasks that don't require education. Being a janitor isn't punishment for not "working hard enough". We're always going to need janitors and other workers. They're valuable members of society who help make civil life possible.
--SoCal is not like NYC or SF where you can walk a few blocks and take a bus or a subway. SoCal blocks are incredibly large. I get in my car to go 2 blocks away, because those blocks are huge. Two of those SoCal blocks are like 6 of my old NYC blocks.
--SoCal is made up of many, many cities over a large, large area. There is no way to get from one corner of Fountain Valley, in a subdivision, to a job in Irvine (relatively close) where the office in an office park is no where near a bus stop. And that's just Fountain Valley to Irvine. This is definitely not an easy situation like covering Manhattan (a single, centralized destination where many of the jobs are.)
--There is no way to setup a workable network of busses/trains to mesh all the cities involved. What's the solution for Costa Mesa to El Segundo? Torrance to Burbank? West Covina to Anaheim? Newport Beach to Norwalk? And so on.
--The bus system we have usually covers a single city and maybe an adjacent city. Going to work for most folks involves going thru 7-10 cities. A simple commute from Costa Mesa to Manhattan Beach could involve going thru (winging it here from memory): Costa Mesa to Fountain Valley, to Huntington Beach, to Westminster, to Bellflower, to Long Beach...(catches breath since I'm not even half way there on the 405 Fwy) to Wilmington, to Carson, to Torrance, to Redondo Beach, to Lawndale, to Manhattan Beach. And you're only at the freeway exit -- now you need to get to the exact office location which means driving thru Manhattan Beach. Take a series of buses, if even possible at all, and you're looking at a 3 hours commute one way.
I would love to take public transportation. It's just not possible. I can't even walk to get lunch. In centrally planned Irvine, they put the housing in one area, the commercial offices in another and the retail commercial spots in another. Even when they are semi-adjacent, the blocks are huge. It would take 30 minutes to walk to the nearest strip mall to get a burger. It's 5 minutes by car.
It sucks, but it's not just an issue of freeways. It's how SoCal is designed.
----------
Edit: adding my solution ---> tax breaks for businesses that allow telecommuting. Keep us off the road and the problem goes away.
+higher quality of life
+less wear and tear on the cars
+less pollution
+less expenses on gas, eating out for lunch
+less maintenance on the roads
+less need for new buses/trains/employees to run them
+less congestion for those that need to be on the road