I hate to be the cynic here but I think you need to really change your attitude if you want to succeed in life. To me your post seems to be "I sort of like computers and my life isn’t working out the way I want so I now want to pursue computers because it looks like my best chance out of the life I’m living"
Well, sorry to say, that isn’t how it works. Don’t get me wrong, if you really work at it I’m sure you can do it but you are WAY behind the curve if you’re 20 years old and have done nothing but tinker with BASIC and C. That said here's my advice...
First, accept you need to work day and night to accomplish your goal. Again, you’re already way behind so you have a lot of catch up to do just to be competent. You should be looking at 70 to 80 hour weeks of pure hard work (including your grocery job).
Second, learn Python (or some other language) backwards and forwards before you even start anything else. Tinkering doesn’t prove anything. Anyone can write a "hello world" app but true programmers have to think in a very specific, logical fashion. You might not have the aptitude for that and there’s no point wasting time pursuing this goal if you’ll never be able to get good at it. You can learn everything you need to know with a search engine these days so there’s no excuse here.
Third, stop thinking in generalizations. No one succeeds by saying "I want to found a start up." You need to latch on to an actual idea and you need to start working on it as soon as you are able. From where you live and the experience you have I figure you’ll need to create a whole product just to interest anyone.
Again, I apologize for the harsh tone but I think it’s justified. As rude as it sounds someone who gets in your position usually doesn’t get out. Getting out will not only be the hardest thing you ever do it will be close to the hardest thing anyone’s ever done. You literally have to remake yourself at a time when many of your instincts have already been formed. It’s not easy, it’s not fun and it will be tons of work and tons of time before you see even a little bit of results.
But if you want to succeed you have to commit yourself to that reality.
How do you learn Python backwards and forwards without using it to do something first? I may be the odd man out here (?), but for me, computers and programming have always been a tool to accomplish something, rather than an end in and of themselves. In my case it was laziness--I couldn't stand the thought of repetitive, redundant data entry and so I set about creating a database app. I had zero background in programming but I did have a) friends to ask questions ("Can you tell me about Alan Turing again?") and b) a compelling interest (said data entry). The logic and the programmer's mental place will come with time.
Also, how is he behind the curve at 20? Don't most people alternate between periods of coasting and advancement? 1500 on the SATs isn't shabby, and if he could pull that off without preparation, his ability multiplier on those 70-80 hour weeks ahead should be enough to get him "caught up" after a few years, if not to expert level then at least middlebrow.
Completely agree re: "I want to found a startup". That may work for some people ("I want to be rich"), but it has always failed to motivate me. If he has something he wants to do and a startup is the best vehicle in which to do it, then yes, found a startup.
You may be right about "the hardest thing". That has the ring of truth.
> Don’t get me wrong, if you really work at it I’m sure you can do it but you are WAY behind the curve if you’re 20 years old and have done nothing but tinker with BASIC and C.
FWIW, many of my coworkers at Google had never written a line of code before they got to college.
As good or better, generally. For entry-level hires (which many of my coworkers were - like many big companies, Google likes to hire straight out of college), Google usually hires for smarts, and once you've been there a year or two, you can pick up all the solid engineering practices and company-specific knowledge. They have nothing to unlearn, which is unfortunately often the case with people who've come from more spaghetti-like codebases.
One observation though - and this is a gross generalization, and obviously doesn't apply to everyone. The people who never studied CS before college and never worked on outside projects tend to be less innovative, less willing to think outside the box. So they're more dependable engineers and often write cleaner code, but they're less likely to come up with a crazy idea or go beyond their established job description.
There are exceptions, of course. Wonder Wheel was done by someone who didn't program until he was a couple years into college, and was initially interested in being a filmmaker (and he's only a year or so out of college, so that's only 3-4 years total experience).
I didn't write my first real program until I was almost 20. I had written some HTML and BAT scripts for MSDOS as a teen but little else.
Then I started really programming a few months before my 24th birthday. It took me less than a year and a half to get to the point where I was confident in applying for nearly any programming job, regardless of the language or skills required. So I would say if you decide to dedicate yourself to it and you are smart(which it seems you are), you could be fairly advanced in <1 year. Definitely not far behind.
My piece of advice: move to the Bay Area!
It is 10x easier to become a better programmer by working with other programmers face to face while getting paid. The job opportunities out here for programmers are probably 50x better than Georgia. So if you could do one thing, that would be it. (Unless you are attached to living in GA, which it doesn't seem like you are).
I found myself thinking the same thing while reading the post. Maybe my cynicism around this issue stems from the fact that I'm 27, have been doing this 10 years, and still have not had a significant exit. (But I've have had a blast on the ride.) I admire the idealism in this post, and reading it makes me almost wish I could rewind and repeat the last 5 but only because retrospect is 20/20.
However, to Tom's point... I think he has many. I picked up on the same tone and think you should carefully evaluate what Tom mentioned in regard to your situation. You're young and have a lot of time so try to remove that pressure from your shoulders, but you really need to get focused on obtaining a basic set of tools before you build a <insert startup here>. Whether it's through college, or sticking your face in front of a monitor for ~40+ hours a week and self teaching yourself X,Y, and Z.
I would say good luck but real entrepreneurs win because of perseverance.
Not too harsh at all. This is actually the most realistic piece of advice so far. I fully realise that I am not where I need to be, and that "tinkering around" isn't nearly good enough. I did not mean to imply that.
I disagree that it will be close to the hardest thing anyone has ever done. Come on now.
It will be extremely hard though, harder than most things, and I am up for the challenge.
Whatever you do, don't waste time learning Python backwards and forwards before you even start doing anything else. Focus on making stuff. I've seen far too many smart people fail miserably because they had the attitude of "as soon as I become an EXPERT in python/machine learning/whatever I can start on my startup." This is a recipe for failure. Build something and learn the details as you go.
It doesn't even have to be your best idea, it just has to be AN IDEA. Just get one full idea implemented and put it out there. Do not get distracted by people who tell you how hard everything is or how it's not fun or how you need to be an expert in something before you can start executing. Just get something done. It's almost the only thing that matters.
This really can't be emphasized enough. I repeatedly fell into this trap of thinking, "If I just master this one more discipline, I'll finally know enough to build what I want". What you end up with is a daunting pile of textbooks to read and no real progress. It's a very insidious form of procrastination because it seems like a good and worthwhile thing to do. Of course, it IS good and worthwhile to learn new things, but learning alone doesn't produce any tangible results.
In the end, you can get a lot further than you think by just puzzling things out for yourself. Try something, see where it fails and adjust as necessary. You'll learn as you go and you'll have the advantage of knowing that what you learned is actually useful knowledge, because it solved a real life problem you encountered.
Along with that: Iterate, release often, refactor, don't be afraid to throw things out, listen to your customers, etc.
But yes, just do it. There's also a lot of value in collaborating with others - see if you can find some person/people to at least bounce ideas if not code off of.
"disagree that it will be close to the hardest thing anyone has ever done. Come on now."
Well, you could be right. I think inherent in the advice I gave above is the idea that it might be too harsh but people who prepare for the worst sail through situations that are easier than the one's they were prepared for.
That said in my observations of the world I've found changing yourself is the hardest thing anyone ever has to do. That's why the astronaut who was successful enough to beat out everyone else in the country can't seem to kick his smoking habit. Or how a guy who managed to become President of the United States TWICE, which is not easy to do, can risk it all for a brief liason with an intern.
Bottom line: Our own vices are generally the hardest opponents to beat
Agreed. Much appreciated. On second thought, you were pretty close to the truth. I'm my worst own enemy in some ways, but I'm changing and maturing every day.
It's not so much that I bend my will easily to the opinions of others. I do believe that there is at least a grain of truth in most well thought out advice, and I do try to be flexible when considering others' opinions. Once I read the comment through a different lens, I saw the truth in what it was saying.
Alternatively, I could just refuse to acknowledge the accuracy of any of this and bicker over minutiae and semantics, but I choose not to.
>>You literally have to remake yourself at a time when many of your instincts have already been formed. It’s not easy, it’s not fun and it will be tons of work and tons of time before you see even a little bit of results.
Julius, if you move somewhere new, you may find the process of metamorphosis becomes easier.
This is the beauty of college: the total newness and change of scenery allows one to change and improve oneself. One's reputation at home no longer matters. One remakes oneself and begins spending time with other motivated people.
You can create a similar situation for yourself by moving. With determination, you will be able to shed the bad parts of yourself and develop the good parts. Moving somewhere new could be a great help. I highly recommend it.
Well, sorry to say, that isn’t how it works. Don’t get me wrong, if you really work at it I’m sure you can do it but you are WAY behind the curve if you’re 20 years old and have done nothing but tinker with BASIC and C. That said here's my advice...
First, accept you need to work day and night to accomplish your goal. Again, you’re already way behind so you have a lot of catch up to do just to be competent. You should be looking at 70 to 80 hour weeks of pure hard work (including your grocery job).
Second, learn Python (or some other language) backwards and forwards before you even start anything else. Tinkering doesn’t prove anything. Anyone can write a "hello world" app but true programmers have to think in a very specific, logical fashion. You might not have the aptitude for that and there’s no point wasting time pursuing this goal if you’ll never be able to get good at it. You can learn everything you need to know with a search engine these days so there’s no excuse here.
Third, stop thinking in generalizations. No one succeeds by saying "I want to found a start up." You need to latch on to an actual idea and you need to start working on it as soon as you are able. From where you live and the experience you have I figure you’ll need to create a whole product just to interest anyone.
Again, I apologize for the harsh tone but I think it’s justified. As rude as it sounds someone who gets in your position usually doesn’t get out. Getting out will not only be the hardest thing you ever do it will be close to the hardest thing anyone’s ever done. You literally have to remake yourself at a time when many of your instincts have already been formed. It’s not easy, it’s not fun and it will be tons of work and tons of time before you see even a little bit of results.
But if you want to succeed you have to commit yourself to that reality.