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decent terminal emulator. -- lie.

makes me vomit. -- visit your local physician.

Unfamiliar key bindings -- "Unfamiliar" by definition = "I don't know it" which isn't the OS's problem. You've gotta admit Command-C for copy being different than Control-C is brilliant.

switching to full height windows -- it's not a maximize button, it's an "optimal size" button. If your content is 500px wide, you don't need a 1000px wide window full of white space.

may be only me -- I'm pretty sure it is (check their stock).




http://www.paulgraham.com/disagree.html

You're so close! Just put some respect in this and it'd be one of the best refutations i've seen on HN in ages.


Respect would require increasing the word count. Hopefully the jump-right-in-and-comment formatting conveyed a half sense of playfulness and half irrational zealotry.

After all, mild humour is always more hilarious when fully explained.


Thank you randall. I lack the ability to down vote (for the seiji's comment) but this made my day. Thank you :)


Terminal as a decent terminal emulator? I believe you are referring to iTerm2 but that's not the default.

unfamiliar key bindings, look for any other keyboard except OsX ones and show me the apple or the option or the command keys then I will back.

For the "Optimal Size button", the underlying operation does not account for the contents width, it only accounts for the desktop height.

The world is not running on OsX or Apple hardware. They have a decent userbase but not the whole computer users are using one.


1. Terminal.app is a very good app. I switched to iTerm 2 a while back, but only because of a few minor features that I could've lived without. What are your problems?

2 & 4. You don't run a Hackintosh and expect it to work. If you want OS X, you buy a Mac. And all Macs (except the Mini) come with standard Apple keyboard.

3. I'm not sure what you're talking about. There's no "magic" algorithm that all apps use. Each app can use its own "algorithm" and can account for screen width as well. Just because Finder.app (most of the time) just grows the height doesn't mean all apps should do it, or are doing it.


Terminal app is a sufficient terminal emulator. But it lacks most of decent options. Can you split windows? Use tabs? Can you change color profiles? May be so many simple decent ap choices are lacking from it. Also I'm not even talking about the lack of simple Terminal emulation modes. I told you I'm a system administrator and I live in terminals. So Terminal.app is not cutting for me.

What's wrong with a Hackintosh other then legal and ethics issues if it's running well? I used Apple hardware and my criticisms were the same.

and for the 3, If every app is using it's own algorithm than I'm really on the wrong side of the issue. And my criticism lacks proper bases. I have to take it back. But again, why not a maximise button?


Terminal has tabs (had it since early 00's).

The lack of split panes was what made me switch to iTerm. I don't use it that often, but it's a "nice to have" feature. Terminal.app has split panes, but it's not "two sessions, side-by-side", rather "different windows into the same session", which I personally don't like much.

And you're right. You can't change the color profile like http://kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=86353 , which might be a bummer for some one like you (you can change the 16 ANSI colors to look less horrible though!).

Why no maximize button? I don't know the reasoning behind that, but I don't miss it. Full screen apps are amazing (for one monitor scenarios), and OS X has a nice handy feature called "Hide Others" (Command-Option-H) that gives you a distraction-free experience without making the app ridiculously large (and showing you a million white pixels!)

[1] touches upon this issue and has good arguments for it.

But of course, power users need more "power", so I also use the wonderful Moom[2] which combined with "Zoom" and "Full Screen" fulfills 100% of my windowing needs.

[1]: http://www.macyourself.com/2011/02/06/why-doesnt-mac-os-xs-g...

[2]: http://manytricks.com/moom/


> And you're right. You can't change the color profile like http://kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=86353

I may be missing something but I don't see how it's different from what has been available since Lion (and since Tiger with a SIMBL plugin). I've been using Zenburn and Solarized since what seems like forever.


"Can you split windows?" - CMD+D splits vertically "Use tabs?" - yes, CMD+T "Can you change color profiles?" - yes "why not a maximise button?" - there is a separate fullscreen button now if you want maximize


> "Can you split windows?" - CMD+D splits vertically

Nitpick: it's different. Cmd+D splits the current buffer in two allowing to view two parts of the same output without scrolling, whereas in iTerm2 it splits into two distinct buffers, each with its own shell.

I arguably prefer the Terminal.app feature, when I have the other one with window management like with Window Magnet, which happens to handle any window, not just what's inside the terminal (in which case I'd simply use vim or tmux splits)


Can you split windows? Use tabs? Can you change color profiles?

Yes to all though you can only split windows horizontally. Terminal is a really good app. iTerm2 is great too but a little slower than Terminal in my experience.


I have to switch my os to check these. If you are right It's better than what I think about it.


What now? I think your mind box may be severely out of alignment with the rest of the world. (It's not an unusual occurrence among extreme computer people.)

Four points. Four points only:

• Terminal.app is perfect. Except for the crashing.

• You can't honestly argue the command key is strange while the windows key isn't (which was a direct copy of "hey, Apple has their own key, why not us?" Also see: recycle bin versus trash can).

• The lil' green button adjusts for width but at max height (unless you are iTunes). It's up to each application to determine how the button should best destroy your viewing experience.

• Do you want to be the most popular or the best? Sugar water or make a difference in the world? Sounds like you may have a case of Bieber Fever.


Are you trying to be sarcastic?

- Terminal.app. If it's perfect what use has iTerm2?

- I'm not ok with windows key too. It has the same twisted mind after it. Also will be out of context but for the record I'm hating Turkey governments hate and movement against Turkish-Q keyboard layout.

- In this optimized button context, I was mistaken about it being a maximize button and it's underlying algorithm. I backed my criticism. But why be different and choose this strange button instead of maximize?

- I can't follow you here.


> If it's perfect what use has iTerm2?

1. alternative 2. hardcore usage 3. opensource

BTW your precious iTerm2 does not handle ICC color profiles, whereas Terminal.app does, and on calibrated screens it shows.


Windows has a perfectly serviceable array of shortcuts available on keyboard that don't have the custom Windows key. The 'windows key stuff' is mostly fluff.


> unfamiliar key bindings, look for any other keyboard except OsX ones and show me the apple or the option or the command keys then I will back.

Huh? On any non-Apple keyboard, the alt keycode corresponds to Command, and the windows keycode corresponds to Option. Since their positions are usually reversed vs Apple keyboards, you can swap them around via the standard Keyboard preference panel.


The problem is that the Command key is also used to do some things that the Alt key isn't on Windows, and there's no way to separate them or rebind the shortcuts (anymore).

Not to mention that you can't remap arbitrary keys in OS X without using third-party software, most of which you have to pay for.

Not that I mind paying for software, but I do mind paying for basic functionality that was present in the last version of the OS.


KeyRemap4MacBook[1] is free.

[1] http://pqrs.org/macosx/keyremap4macbook/


That doesn't let you remap arbitrary keys; it lets you remap keys in the configurations they've pre-defined for you. That's not the same thing.

Also, the implementation is really wonky, so if you want to do a circular remap (ie, A->B, B->C, C->A), you'll end up with really weird interactions.

It's a stopgap hack at best.


Is the complaint here that Mac OS (any version) isn't Windows?

The alt key on Windows doesn't do the same things the command key does in Mac OS, because they are different operating systems. What an utterly vacuous point.




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