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Martin-Baker Ejection Seat Made Its First of 7,722 Saves 75 Years Ago Today (twz.com)
94 points by vinnyglennon 7 months ago | hide | past | favorite | 51 comments



I don't know if it was a Martin-Baker ejection seat, but this pilot's account of surviving an ejection from 78,000 ft at Mach 3.18 (3926,664 km/h!) in a SR-71 Blackbird is pretty wild.

http://www.chuckyeager.org/news/sr-71-disintegrated-pilot-fr...


Thanks for the link, that was a great read! What a story.

Minor nit pick, the pilot did not in fact eject. He was literally thrown out of the disintegrating aircraft, ripping his shoulder and waist harnesses in the process. Insane stuff, especially that he survived.


My dad used to know a marine fighter pilot who survived an ejection at mach 1.2. Each leg broke in four places and the soles of feet were pressed flat against his chest hard enough to break many of his ribs. But the seat worked and was certainly responsible for saving his life.


I'm having a hard time imagining how the bottom of his feet were pressed against his chest?!

Were his knees bent the wrong way?


I'm guessing that has to do with his legs being broken in four places


A quick search suggests the SR-71 had Lockheed-designed seats.


You're right. I found this link[1]that describes (in great detail) the seat used in the SR-71.

As an aside, the website (ejectionseat.com) is a trip itself.

[1] https://www.ejectionsite.com/sr1seat.htm


Top Gun Maverick movie starts with reenactment of that scene. Totally worth watching.

Sad part of the story is that the other pilot of the original Blackbird incident didn't survive. The surviving pilot saw his companion's parachute and was thus (thinking that he survived) motivated to fight for his own life.


"Standby for Ejection!" - https://youtu.be/5QF2F51adjA


This pilot's account of ejecting underwater (!!) after a failed carrier landing is truly amazing: https://www.ejectionsite.com/eunderh2o.htm


There’s also this video about under water ejection: https://youtu.be/CfVKUdA433Q


Don't know if other manufacturers do it, but Martin-Baker give you a branded tie if your life is saved by one of their seats.

It's covered in logos that look like the ejection handle.


Used MB ejection seats were re-used in flight sims.

When I worked in the industry (electronics eng), I saw one in either a Jaguar or Tornado sim under construction and it had a brass plaque on the side naming the pilot and day of activation, along the lines of "On [DATE], [PILOT], ejected safely from their aircraft in this seat."


You also have a right to buy a watch from Bremont: https://www.cntraveler.com/stories/2015-05-13/eject-from-pla...


Here's an interesting old training video from the RAF that shows the details of how the ejection seat works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vU7A2Q9sSCw


This was a wonderful video in a style I sorely miss (not the QT, but the 1980/90's RAF and Public Information style).


Over 100 successful ejections per year? That's wild! That sounds like an awful lot of hull losses. And how many people weren't saved?

What's the risk calculus look like for a plane with an ejection seat vs. a plane without one? War obviously has one risk profile, but military vehicles and their operation differ wildly from day to day commercial operation.


I thought they have a monopoly on ejection seats, but I've found at least 1 other manufacturer: https://www.collinsaerospace.com/what-we-do/industries/milit...

Martin Baker's website is a bit wild, you can join their "tie club", but to do so you need to have ejected using their seat: https://martin-baker.com/tie-club/

And they list the ejections they know of https://martin-baker.com/ejection-notices/ , but the records are a bit jumbled, the latest entries include ejections in the past that they've discovered, and they don't all have dates, even "Someone successfully ejected today". Today when, man?!


You can even buy a special watch with colored case that signifies you ejected from an aircraft (using a Martin-Baker Ejection Seat of course)

https://martin-baker.com/watches/mb-i/


I collect watches, I'd love to have one of these but they are probably super rare to find second hand. Obviously I'd never be in a position to buy one from retail...

There are a couple of pretty special pilot only watches. I like IWCs top gun too, the one with the real top-gun logo on only avialable to pilots that have graduated Top Gun.

Available to top gun graduates: https://www.iwc.com/content/iwc/americas/us/en/articles/jour...

The retail version: https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.watche...

The people that actually get these watches don't seem to want to sell them, understandably.


And since these companies probably don't sell to Russia, Russia has their own manufacturer: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NPP_Zvezda . Interestingly Collins' origin seem to be seats designed by Zvezda: https://archive.is/www.nytimes.com/1998/12/02/nyregion/metro...


The Collins equivalent seems to be the "Grasshopper Club": https://www.collinsaerospace.com/what-we-do/industries/milit...

They mention the B-2 as a platform, that one was the most expensive aircraft crash in history according to Wikipedia.


> found at least 1 other manufacturer

that's Zvezda K-36


When I was in USAF, the pilots said, "When your fear of staying in the plane exceeds your fear of the ejection system, it's time to eject." That wasn't really a joke.


I've seen comparisons of American vs. Russian ejector seats. It appears that Russian seats are better designed to protect the pilot from injury while ejecting. The issue of ejector seats has been used to support the idea that pilot comfort and safety is a low priority for American designers.


Soviet designs tend to be more artisanal. Sometimes it gives them oxygen-rich rocket engines and better engineered ejection seats, other times it malfunctions and flip over ISS or send a space probe back down to earth by accidentally cryogenically freezing out a computer.


Do the Russians have zero-zero systems?

I know the US seats have started taking into account pilot weight to modulate thrust to limit the Gs to what is necessary


They had those a long time ago. One of the few parts of their airplanes that was actually quite good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jklGQxAOoo8&t=9m45s


"Russian pilot's cam ejecting from shot down Su-25SM3": https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/ybdldt/insan...


Since even a successful ejection will hurt you due to the immense forces at play (an explosion will push you out the plane) even in the best case, and crush you, if something goes wrong, no wonder that joke is for real.


Yeah ejection is no joke. It's pretty much guaranteed to get at least spinal damage due to compression.


>Over 100 successful ejections per year? That's wild! That sounds like an awful lot of hull losses.

I remember calculating a few years ago that more than 10% of the ejector seats sold by Martin-Baker have been used to eject.

Military aircraft operations, even in peacetime, are much more dangerous than the vast majority of civilian fixed-wing flight (except airshows/racing and maybe cropdusting). I don't know how much of that difference is the flight profile being inherently more dangerous (closer to terrain), and how much is it being harder on the aircraft.


They're more dangerous mostly because they're optimized for maneuverability which requires trading off aerodynamic stability and glide ratio. All aircraft have problems mid-flight and most pilot training is about how to deal with that but when something goes wrong, fighter jets just don't have much time to recover before they plummet. That maneuverability also makes it a lot easier to get disoriented and lose control.

Trainer jets like the L39 albatross have a less maneuverable design in exchange for being a lot more survivable in event of a problem. The engines themselves aren't that much less reliable - some engines like the Garrett TFE731 have a TBO of 4,000 hours which is significantly more than many GA engines like the Continental in an entry level Cessna.


>some engines like the Garrett TFE731 have a TBO of 4,000 hours which is significantly more than many GA engines like the Continental in an entry level Cessna.

That shouldn't be a big surprise: jet engines are turbines with basically only one moving part that just spins, whereas those crappy GA engines are reciprocating piston engines with designs that haven't changed since the 1950s.


This incredible reliability is the justification for TOPS and ETOPS policy in which suitably qualified aeroplanes with only two jet engines are allowed to fly over an ocean. Before TOPS this is why you see jet aeroplanes with three engines, they don't need three engines to fly, but the regulations required that if two engines fail the plane must get to safety, with TOPS that's no longer required (hence the joke expansion for ETOPS: Engines Turn Or Passengers Swim) and so new planes with three engines didn't make sense.

With piston engines two engines failing is a completely reasonable thing which will sometimes happen to say, a transatlantic flight. In the early days of such travel, the demands are such that all the practical aeroplanes are four engine models anyway, so limping to an abort airfield on two engines was a reasonable strategy if two failed, but once jet engines on passenger planes were a thing, their enormous reliability makes this unnecessary hence TOPS and then ETOPS.


The mentions of TOPS above are a brain misfire. ETOPS was altered repeatedly but it was always named ETOPS, at first allowing 90 minutes, then 120 minutes and eventually 180 minutes of assumed single engine range. A modern twin engine jet can go a long way in 180 minutes at design single engine performance.


Military trainer jets have two seats so most crashes count for two ejections. Martin Baker has been fitted into 200 different aircraft types in 90 countries so averaged out that's only 0.5-1 hulls lost per customer per year.


Probably some years with much higher numbers due to wars that would skew the average.


That includes the Vietnam and Korean wars - lots of pilots got shot down


unfortunately, one killed an RAF Red Arrows pilot at RAF Scampton when it activated unexpectedly - but this is very rare in the history of the seats.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Sean_Cunningham


The old factory is now kind of like a new-age mall with small stores, good restaurants, bars, etc outside of Denver. Very cool spot.


When can we have ejector seats for commercial airplane cabins. Or.. "ejector cabins"?


We have "ballistic recovery systems" that are basically giant parachutes for entire (small) aircraft


I've seen those for very small one-man drones. Are you talking about Cessna-size?


Yes, they even come standard on some planes, like on all Cirrus SR planes.


CAPS: Cirrus Airframe Parachute System. Realistically it's not practical to retro-fit this technology, so you would almost invariably buy a plane with it.

Cirrus also solves the other problem that's of growing importance in the US with increasingly elderly private pilots - what if your plane is fine but the pilot is incapacitated (e.g. stroke)? Emergency autoland means the plane itself is capable of determining a suitable landing site, navigating there, broadcasting its intentions to other aircraft and landing, then switching itself off, meaning the passengers (and possibly the pilot depending on what exactly was wrong) survive the incident.


It is realistic to retrofit, and it's done regularly:

https://www.aviationconsumer.com/safety/brs-parachute-retrof...


I don't know about "regularly" when they're citing one person who did most of these retrofits - that sounds like it's not happening very often at all, my uncle used to do GA maintenance in (the state of) Georgia, and never saw this as a Cessna mod.

But I'll concede that article makes it clear this is a real thing non-crazy people do which I was not aware of.


My guess is that more lives would be lost from accidental or inappropriate activation than would be saved (even if you ignore all the reasons why it would be impractical anyway).


"Ejector seat? You're joking."

"I never joke about my work, 007."


Imagine just how many more could have been saved if we just stopped bombarding each other for profit?




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