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What's that? (spottedsun.com)
201 points by veb on March 21, 2012 | hide | past | favorite | 60 comments



I actually think it's not respectful of visitors' time to only describe your site in a video. I know, it's only 30 seconds, but that's about 25 seconds longer than it takes me to read a short text description. And if I need to find my headphones, it's not 30 seconds anymore.

What's wrong with writing, anyway?


Enthusiastically seconded. Nothing makes me hit the back button faster on a startup/app website than a mostly-empty page with a video on it. Especially when the video is just a close-up of somebody's face talking, i.e. there's nothing that requires a video to demonstrate.


I'm curious if videos really do scare people away. If you take a look at dropbox and cloudflare they do a really good job at using a video to demonstrate their product. Now taking into consideration the size of dropbox's and cloudflare's users, I'm more inclined to the idea that "videos work".


It's not that videos scare people away, but they need to be augmented. Would Dropbox convert better if they had descriptive text on their home page, or at least made the features link more visible than the one in the footer? We'll never know unless Dropbox tests it and publishes the results.

When I think of software sold to businesses, I'm reminded of the place I used to work where the president had the IT department disable the speakers on all new PC's. He didn't want employees sitting around watching videos or listening to music on company time. It may be hard to fathom for some people, but there are offices where playing videos (even demos) is frowned upon - especially in a cube farm.

If you want to make conversions, think of all the barriers between you and the sale, and start knocking them down one by one. Making your products key features readable and crawl-able for search engines is an easy one.


As someone from the affiliate space where EVERYTHING gets splittested I can tell you that videos generally own all other forms of website content when trying to get the user to do something (download, signup, buy).

>Would Dropbox convert better if they had descriptive text on their home page, or at least made the features link more visible than the one in the footer? We'll never know unless Dropbox tests it and publishes the results.

of course DB tested their homepage a ton


Not sure about scaring people away, just pushes time-conscious people away, which is true for me personally


They don't scare me. I just don't bother watching them if I don't know what will be explained in them beforehand. I am a quick reader, but I cannot accelerate your video.

If video is your only explanation, I'll never come back.


I don't think I have ever seen Dropbox video, even though I have been using it for years.


We have a text description at http://getliveloop.com but to tell you the truth, the video is the easiest, and dare I say, quickest way to understand what we do. The reason we have the text is that our target users are PowerPoint users, who often work in settings where they cannot listen to audio.

Obviously a site should have both text and video but I don't blame anyone who does the video first.


> to tell you the truth, the video is the easiest, and dare I say, quickest way to understand what we do

About 20 seconds in, your video says:

Liveloop is a simple powerpoint plugin that lets everyone work on the document at the same time, seeing everyone else's changes as they type.

That is the quickest way to understand what you do. If I want to see it in action, I can click through to a video demonstration.


Unless they just changed it, they seem to have snappy taglines that explain it well already:

Liveloop is really real-time collaboration within Powerpoint

Collaborate in real-time, keystroke by keystroke, without ever leaving Office.

These aren't bad. I wonder if they have tested them with the target market.

I have sympathy. It's a hard concept to get across.

That said, it takes until 2:30 in the video before we see people collaborating on the same slide at the same time. And there might be a bit of meta-confusion because they're working on a presentation for "LiveLoop Zoo". I know that seems like a harmless self-reference, but I've seen people get tripped up on much easier ideas.

That seems a bit wrong. I wonder if, instead of a video where I have to press "play", we could have a silent animation that starts immediately on the home page. Show two cartoon figures typing into PowerPoint screens, with their changes reflected immediately. (And it's never bad to show human faces with emotions.)

Anyway, that sort of thing is hard, and they're to be commended for getting this far, my armchair criticism aside.


A simple A/B test would answer this question.


How about doing hallway usability testing? Show the page to people in the target market for five seconds and then ask them "what does this company do?" Five of these will tell you everything you need to know.

If you don't have a constant stream of fresh users walking through your offices, you can do something on http://www.usertesting.com/ .



Out of curiosity, how do you A/B test understanding?


A/B testing understanding might not be feasible, but in the end, they are trying to sell their plugin so A/B testing for signups or sales or something like sounds like a good correlation to understanding.


I don't disagree that the video is the easiest and quickest way for you. The point is that it's harder for many/most users than reading text. Think about it in terms of system requirements:

- Web page with text as the primary -> a browser

- Web page with video as the primary -> a browser, sound device, sound output device, absence of anything else using the sound device (this means I have to pause my music), etc.

More requirements -> fewer useful impressions. And again, what's wrong with writing? Even YC makes applicants send a (text) description of their plan. It should be a red flag if you cannot describe your business in a short text snippet.


I must not be clear, there is text right under the video, but the video is the one that gets the most responses.


Yes, I saw the page. I'm not sure how you test that the video is getting more responses, but could it be that this is the case because you don't have your one-sentence pitch in text on the site? This is the pitch from the video, which isn't on the home page:

Liveloop is a simple powerpoint plugin that lets everyone work on the document at the same time, seeing everyone else's changes as they type.

That alone could be why the video converts better: it tells (not shows) what you do in a way the text doesn't. To do a fair test, you'd need to have text materially similar to what's in the video.


the video is the easiest, and dare I say, quickest way to understand what we do

Another way of saying that is that the site's target audience is people for whom that video is the easiest/quickest way to receive knowledge.


> The reason we have the text is that our target users are PowerPoint users, who often work in settings where they cannot listen to audio.

You say a video is best, even though you also say that a video isn't best for your target audience?

Accessibility makes things better for everyone, not just those people who need it. If you'd approached this with accessibility in mind you'd have realised that a video was sub-optimal, and come up with some form of text. That (while not covering everything) would have been more helpful for more people. As can be seen from the comments here.


I did design it with accessibility in mind. There is a text description right under the video, and there are captions on the video itself. But neither of those change the fact that the video is the most compelling way to communicate what we're doing.


I apologise for my tone.


I agree completely. I can't remember how many times I clicked a link on HN, discovered that there was nothing but a video on that page, and just closed the tab. Text is great, pictures are OK, but a video? You just added unnecessary friction. There goes your conversion rate.


To play devil's advocate, the Dropbox homepage is nothing but a big play button w/ video. But I agree not every product needs a video.

I agree that using subtitles everywhere is a good thing.


The difference is that Dropbox was a product everyone already understood the concept behind--nobody needed five paragraphs of text to understand "it syncs files"--but was sold entirely on the execution, and how much better that execution was than all the challengers who had failed to penetrate the space before it. And you really can't get execution from a speel.

To make a gaming analogy: you can effectively market a JRPG through commercials, because, in essence, what people are buying is the narrative. But you can't market Tetris in a commercial, because what's being bought there is the experience of gameplay. Some things can simply be described; other things can only be shown; and still others need to be played with.


An anecdotal counterpoint:

I joined dropbox when I heard from a friend how well-designed it was. I then proceeded to sign up for it _despite_ my frustration at the video-only front page. I never did watch the video.


Not sure what's wrong with writing, but candyjapan.com without a video on the page converted at 0.5% and with video at 1.3%. Of course no reason not to have both video AND text.

Granted the contents in the video are not the same as the explanation text is, so might be attributable just to the difference in content. Or possibly just random chance (36 conversions 3784 visits).


36 conversions/3784 visits sounds like random fluctuations to me. Also, was it video+text, or video instead of text?


Another way to say conversion went from 0.5% to 1.3% is to say visitors were over 2.5 times more likely to convert if there was video than if there wasn't. In those terms, random fluctuations seem less likely as the reason for the difference.


FWIW:

  > chisq.test(matrix(c(10,3784/2,26,3784/2),2,2))
          Pearson's Chi-squared test with Yates' continuity correction
  ... p-value = 0.0129


Yes, but it's just because it sounds different. IMO both the absolute and relative number of people lay in a range of what I would expect to be random fluctuations.


What's wrong with writing?

A substantial proportion of internet users are functionally illiterate.

If your website targets a mass audience, you will be dealing with a large proportion of users (probably about 15%) who have the reading skills of an eighth-grader or worse. They're the great invisible demographic in UX.


And while we're on it, make sure websites are operable by keyboard too (tab and enter, mostly). What for? Visually impaired people.

I know someone who is totally blind, has worked with MS-DOS while he could see, but got blind before Windows 3.1 even came out. Yet he works with and version of Windows, sends and reads email, searches videos on Youtube, and browses the web. That last one is becoming more and more tricky with div-onclick="location=somewhere;" (instead of a-href) and other Javascript all over the place.

Screen readers are made to read text. Flash is hard but sometimes possible, Javascript is becoming a good competitor to Flash in the sense of that it's rendering the web almost as inaccessible.

Images too are a problem of course, without alt attribute they are totally worthless to blind people.

So if you want to present something to the entire market, be sure to have either an accessible website or a mobile version, both preferably in the local language (you should hear how Dutch text to speech software reads English, sounds more like Chinese--literally). And there are about 160 million people blind around the world, even if only a tenth of that speaks English and has internet access, that are 16 million people. Nearly as much as the entire population of the Netherlands.


As with the captioning recommendation, enhancements for disabled users are also huge wins with both many other users, and, very often, search engines.

I don't know that search engines use tab order to parse fields, but they very well might and could.

I know that especially when it comes to web-based admin tools, something that:

1: Works well with keyboard navigation.

2: Works (at all) in a console-mode browser.

... is going to get a hell of a lot more interest from me than something which:

1: Doesn't readily support keyboard nav.

2: Doesn't work in a console-mode browser.

3: Requires Flash.

4: Requires some specific/minimum browser version/release.

5: Requires MSIE.

From 3 onwards, these are instant death for any enterprise tool I'm evaluating.


Very true, I would also prefer something that works even in a text based browser. I've never really 100% fit in with the user standard, being one of the first to browse the web from my mobile phone (Nokia 6230i back then) or using alternative browsers when MSIE's market share was still >90%. I've had more than enough compatibility trouble to go along with something working on only some systems.

(For example I'm currently building a website which will also support everything from high-end desktops to text-based terminals. Only disqus comments are a pain, making the page size go from 23KB to over 500KB and requiring Javascript, but the tradeoff seems worth it--trust me, I thought it trough over and over and over lol.)


This is a huge problem! I did some work for the Assistive Technology Industry Association (ATIA) and video is very inaccessible. This is a problem not only for people with bad or impaired hearing. Imagine trying to figure out what a video was trying to demonstrate if you were blind!

W3C has created the Web Acceptability Initiative (WAI) with the goal of creating a common set of web standards so that all people can access content. Check out the WAI homepage for best practices and code examples: http://www.w3.org/WAI/


I have a feeling I might use the "accessible" version of a page more regularly, if it were widespread enough for people like me who don't need it to be aware of it.


And even if you don't care about people who are hard of hearing, think about those of us who are at work, or in a public place, and don't have a pair of headphones available.


I'm not hearing impaired, but my first language is Spanish. I can read almost anything in English, but sometimes it is difficult for me to understand fast spoken English. So, if you care about international users, you also should add captions to the videos.


This is actually not a rant - it's a wake up call.


You, sirs and/or ladies have my thanks for bringing this up. You have my vote on this one, no questions asked.


We just released an app intro video at Budgetable http://budgetable.com ... Adding captions didn't even cross my mind, but we'll do it.


I don't like being reminded / told I'm wasteful with my decisions. Other people might be turned off by the insinuation too. my free 2 cents


Thanks for the feedback. This is a feature we're experimenting with. I think its appeal will be dependent mostly on its accuracy.. it's pretty accurate, but there will be room for improvements.


Your site gets a no, there's not enough immediately visible copy for me to determine if the value prop is worth my time.

You will never have me as a customer unless you move the video to a non-index page and instead lead in with copy+visuals. Offer a link to the idea for people who want the audiovisual explanation instead.


Hmm... I have to disagree with you here. There is a title and a subtitle above the video. Those two elements provide enough information for the user to determine if they want to watch the video. Captions would still be a plus, though.


They're your customers to lose.

Prove me wrong and A-B test it against some good textual copy. Track actual conversions.

Use these guys as inspiration without stealing their design like those boneheads from a month or two ago: http://campfirenow.com


And if I win, you'll sign up for Budgetable? ;)


No, but if I win, I'll revisit your site and read the actual copy and you'll get a chance at a customer.

Regardless of the outcome, you win because now you have actual data to make a decision with.

For me to agree to sign up that your AB test wins, I'd have to proctor the test and at that point, you'd owe me for consulting services.


Oh, it's on


There are tradeoffs involved in having some important material below the fold, but I don't think it's universally a bad idea.

http://iampaddy.com/lifebelow600/


Give a bone less about the fold, I loaded the page, didn't see copy, just a big fat video frame. Closed the page.

The fold becomes irrelevant when you give me offensive/non-content above it and no reason to go digging for more.

It only makes sense to go ahead and put plenty of content below the fold once you've hooked me and given me a reason to continue.

Videos leave me wanting and the browser tab closed. A video frame shouldn't be the first thing I see unless the domain is youtube.com.


I'm profoundly deaf, and wish I had thought of making this post. I've lost track of the number of times I have been put off a product because their only description is in video form.

I sometimes forgive start-ups for not captioning videos, but I think it's inexcusable when a large multinational corporation publishes a video with no captions -- especially if they pay for live captioning for employees in meetings (e.g., by using http://www.captionfirst.com/).


And for those who have a slow connection, a video is just a big back button. (speaking from experience)


I'm very confused about why this story has so many votes. spottedsun.com doesn't even resolve for me.


Can you pastebin your nslookup/dig results? Try directing it at another dns 8.8.8.8

nslookup spottedsun.com 8.8.8.8


Weird. Still resolving for me.

http://pastie.org/pastes/3645637/text


At first I was annoyed with the non-descriptive title, but I clicked it anyway to see what it was. I don't know if it was intentional, but the title helps convey how useless audio is to people who can't hear.

And even as a non-hearing-impaired person, I concur with the request for subtitles and/or not using videos so much because they waste time.


If a video has captions I often prefer to watch it muted. I'm not even hearing impaired. Sound is overrated. ;-)




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