Again, I'm not sure how dumb bombing entire cities that haven't been evacuated, maternity/childrens wards, and fleeing civilians _doesn't_ qualify as genocide, but I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.
I think the definition of genocide is very clear and after watching the daily footage from Ukraine, it's quite difficult to make the argument that there isn't intent to wipe out a large portion of the population systematically. Yeah, their names aren't in a spreadsheet maybe, yet, but this is just beginning.
Something can be a war crime AND not a genocide. (I recommend you wikileaks for a list of US war crimes which aren't genocides).
Putin invasion is illegal, many war crimes were committed, but it's nowhere close to a genocide. What word will you use for real genocides ?
> and after watching the daily footage from Ukraine
That's the main issue with this war, people are fed clips after clips of bombings videos, crying civilians, dead soldiers in blood pools &c. It's an information war just as much as it is a regular war
If we had the same level of publicity for the invasion or Irak or Afghanistan would you have condemned the US of genocide ? Many more civilians died. Would we have banned the US of swift ?
What about the siege of Sarajevo ? genocide committed by nato ?
It's a war, did people forget about them ? Civilians always suffer, either directly or indirectly (starvation, exposure, &c.)
Unplug, stop watching war porn, read experts reports if you want to keep up to date, don't fall for the news cycle/social media bait. There are 30 or 40 other wars going on in the world right now, all with civilians getting killed, if you want to be outraged every single second of your life feel free to look them up. There even is a real genocide going on for the last 10 years or so in Darfur, have you heard of it ? it's not making the news, 100k to 400k people were killed though
> I think the definition of genocide is very clear
It is, and no serious source calls this a genocide...
> It is, and no serious source calls this a genocide...
Again, incorrect. The Ukrainian government has called this genocide. Are they not a serious source? The UN has also had at least one hearing so far to determine if there is genocide happening in Ukraine right now, which, I'll note, the Russians did not show up for. [0]
I'm going to go ahead and stop replying to you at this point. You've made a number of assumptions about my level of engagement and education on the topic that are incorrect, and I don't feel like we are going to get anywhere.
At any rate, insisting that the systematic carpet bombing of cities and murder of fleeing civilians _isn't_ genocide, seems like a questionable hill to die on.
> Again, incorrect. The Ukrainian government has called this genocide
And Russia says there is no war... don't you think Ukraine and Russia stances might be slightly biased ? If we're arguing with that level of bad faith I agree that it won't go anywhere.
> insisting that the systematic carpet bombing of cities and murder of fleeing civilians _isn't_ genocide, seems like a questionable hill to die on.
It's a warcrime, it's not a genocide, I'll die on that hill, words have meaning. Otherwise every single conflict is a genocide, but then the word loses its meaning entirely so why not stop using it ?
Again, it's a question of scale and intent. Putting every single jew you find in trains for death camps is a genocide, killing every single Vietnamese you find is a genocide, killing a few civilians while bombing a city at war is a war crime.
Well, in the case the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki are genocide! The all the Americans(still alive) and American state entities responsible for it must be held accountable
I think the definition of genocide is very clear and after watching the daily footage from Ukraine, it's quite difficult to make the argument that there isn't intent to wipe out a large portion of the population systematically. Yeah, their names aren't in a spreadsheet maybe, yet, but this is just beginning.