> Lots of HN comments are here like "I know people who prefer to be contractors", "My sister's neighbours little brother actually doesn't want to be treated with respect by Uber", blah
It's a willful misrepresentation to characterize these merely as anecdotes. Polls/surveys show that drivers overwhelmingly share this sentiment[1].
> This is utter nonsense. Being a contractor means being self employed. You don't get paid leave or sick pay. It's a risk taking and doesn't make any sense in the gig economy where the wages are close to minimum rates.
This is not a prerequisite for being a "contractor". That the rates are "close to minimum rates" is a reflection of the market demand for the labor.
> If you are truly self employed then you have a skill which you can market, you can charge fees which allows one to put money aside for things like unpaid leave or sick days.
Again, this is nice in theory, but not necessarily true for all self employed contractors.
> If you are truly self employed then part of your job is building customer relationship, building up recurring customers, increasing your business through marketing, word of mouth, etc.
Again, this is nice in theory, but not necessarily true for all self employed contractors.
> Uber drivers are NONE of this.
Correct, but that doesn't change the fact that they are not employees.
> They clock into an app which belongs to someone else and they have no share in.
This was true before Uber/Lyft, where taxi drivers had to pay for the privilege of driving a car with a medallion that belonged to someone else. They were independent contractors under that arrangement.
Today, Uber/Lyft drivers report to no boss and can decide to drive whenever they want on a whim. They can drive 20 hours one week, 2 hours the next, and then take a vacation indefinitely with no repercussions. When Uber/Lyft announce layoffs for cost cutting, drivers are notably not affected. Insofar as drivers have experienced less work during COVID, it’s because there are fewer riders requesting rides, which suggests a rather direct rider-to-driver relationship.
> They can't even negotiate their own fees. That itself is fucked up.
Yes, Uber drivers can’t really set their own rates (this is changing soon), but that’s also not really a prerequisite for independence. There are loads of platforms where the intermediary only buys services by providers at set rates and sells them to a buyer, where the providers are not literally employees of the platform provider, eg: health insurance. This was also true of taxi drivers before Uber/Lyft came around.
> It's complete nonsense in extremely disingenuous by anyone here to suggest that an Uber driver is a self employed contractor and that this is good for them.
This is a borderline rule breaking content on its face, but just to engage with it, how do you know what's good for them? Maybe get off your high horse and speak for yourself.
It's a willful misrepresentation to characterize these merely as anecdotes. Polls/surveys show that drivers overwhelmingly share this sentiment[1].
> This is utter nonsense. Being a contractor means being self employed. You don't get paid leave or sick pay. It's a risk taking and doesn't make any sense in the gig economy where the wages are close to minimum rates.
This is not a prerequisite for being a "contractor". That the rates are "close to minimum rates" is a reflection of the market demand for the labor.
> If you are truly self employed then you have a skill which you can market, you can charge fees which allows one to put money aside for things like unpaid leave or sick days.
Again, this is nice in theory, but not necessarily true for all self employed contractors.
> If you are truly self employed then part of your job is building customer relationship, building up recurring customers, increasing your business through marketing, word of mouth, etc.
Again, this is nice in theory, but not necessarily true for all self employed contractors.
> Uber drivers are NONE of this.
Correct, but that doesn't change the fact that they are not employees.
> They clock into an app which belongs to someone else and they have no share in.
This was true before Uber/Lyft, where taxi drivers had to pay for the privilege of driving a car with a medallion that belonged to someone else. They were independent contractors under that arrangement.
Today, Uber/Lyft drivers report to no boss and can decide to drive whenever they want on a whim. They can drive 20 hours one week, 2 hours the next, and then take a vacation indefinitely with no repercussions. When Uber/Lyft announce layoffs for cost cutting, drivers are notably not affected. Insofar as drivers have experienced less work during COVID, it’s because there are fewer riders requesting rides, which suggests a rather direct rider-to-driver relationship.
> They can't even negotiate their own fees. That itself is fucked up.
Yes, Uber drivers can’t really set their own rates (this is changing soon), but that’s also not really a prerequisite for independence. There are loads of platforms where the intermediary only buys services by providers at set rates and sells them to a buyer, where the providers are not literally employees of the platform provider, eg: health insurance. This was also true of taxi drivers before Uber/Lyft came around.
> It's complete nonsense in extremely disingenuous by anyone here to suggest that an Uber driver is a self employed contractor and that this is good for them.
This is a borderline rule breaking content on its face, but just to engage with it, how do you know what's good for them? Maybe get off your high horse and speak for yourself.
[1] https://www.cadriversurvey.com/