Coast-to-coast AP demo was promised before Eo2017. Still waiting. Meanwhile, the AP cannot handle traffic lights, city traffic, conditions of bad weather, sections of road with poor or temporary lanes, it crashes to high-vis large stationary objects directly in line of sight and travel, yada yada. They don't seem to have anything solid to back up the promises with, so claiming that "enabling automatic driving on city streets and highways pending regulatory approval" is very deceptive and insincere with potential customers.
The coast-to-coast demo for EoY 2017 was not a promise either, but a goal.
Elon Musk, 2017:
>Our goal is — I feel pretty good about this goal — is that we’ll be able to do a demonstration drive of full autonomy, all the way from L.A. to New York — so, basically, from a home in L.A. to, let’s say, dropping you off in Times Square, in New York, then having the car go and park itself by the end of next year — without the need for a single touch, including the charging.
Elon Musk, 2018:
>I’ve been meaning to address this, because obviously I missed the mark on that front. I mean, focus was very much on Model 3 production so everything else kind of took a second place to that. We could have done the coast-to-coast drive but it would have required too much specialized code to effectively game it, or make it somewhat brittle in that it would work for one particular route but not be a general solution.
Who's hyping things up here?
>They don't seem to have anything solid to back up the promises (...)
So now you say "they don't seem to", because you don't know? Okay.
It's a funny concept. People who haven't even purchased the product feel that the company has promised them things and feel aggravated if those "promises" go unfulfilled.
In reality, Tesla is a company with such ambitious goals that they often fail only to later succeed. The fact that so many people want to tear them down for that is very sad.
From earlier in this thread: ”Our goal is — I feel pretty good about this goal — is that we’ll be able to do a demonstration drive of full autonomy, all the way from L.A. to New York”
I guess it depends whether you interpret that “I feel good about this goal” means “I think we have a good chance of achieving this” or just “having this goal makes me feel good.”
I think we’re at least partly agreeing. Tesla just has a very different approach here than, say, Apple. That’s not inherently bad but I personally don’t like it. I see it as excessive hype.
I guess my question would be... There's thousands or tens of thousands of businesses not meeting their stated goals. Why do you care so much about tearing down this particular one?
Perhaps you follow $tslaq on Twitter or perhaps not. Take a look. They're so toxic and focused on negativity around Tesla. It's senseless. If I don't believe in a business, I just ignore it. With Tesla there seems to be people who are religious or obsessed with hoping that they fail. That's pretty weird considering that pretty much all of humankind benefits from a better world should they succeed.
Being in AI myself, I care about the bullshit Musk spews.
He's horribly wrong about everything he says on the topic, and spreading misinformation every time he opens his mouth.
His activity in the field may hinder future development and lead us towards another AI winter. Having any-and-all people working on a particular task isn't necessarily a good thing.
> “I think we have a good chance of achieving this”
That's still not promising anything though. It's setting expectations, but failing to meet expectations is not the same as failing to meet promises.
If I buy a movie ticket I can get disappointed about the film being bad (failing to meet expectation of enjoyment), but I'd get upset if they cancelled the screening after I bought a ticket (failing to meet promise of viewing).
Volkswagen is promising (to use your terms) to produce millions of cheap EVs in 2019... err, 2020... er, by 2025. They’re doing that for years, without producing barely anything. Meanwhile Tesla is overly optimistic, sets high goals, fails on some of them, is late, but still actually delivers a shitload of great stuff.
Yes, I’m still waiting on some things them dreamt about when I bought the car. OTOH, I’m happy with the purchase and the car got dramatically improved software-wise since I bought it, well beyond any other manufacturer’s abilities.
"Liar" is a stronger word than I would use, but given the claims (including dates) that Tesla made when I purchased an S100D in early 2017 -- seems like the answer is Tesla.
If not "liar", at least incredibly dramatically wrong about what they actually delivered for EAP and FSD. I'd say the burden of proof is now firmly on Tesla as they've made and missed a number of claims about the performance of their automation features.
