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Cloudflare seem to be big backers of http/3 [1].

Having the second-largest traffic analyzer on board would seem like more of a cautionary negative than a positive to me.




Tinfoil hat off for a second it makes more sense Cloudflare and Google are backing these protocols because they're more efficient which means lower infrastructure costs. They both terminate traffic already so can already see everything regardless of the protocol used.


I am not the person you responded to. However, I would only be considering things that people in general are eager to use not just a few big companies. Most users of HTTP have never been too concerned with it's overhead. Except maybe the way cookies have been design. It definitely has problems, but most peoples problems are not googles or cloud flares.


So we should be against something that makes all sites faster... because big companies care more about their sites being fast? That just seems like spite to me.

If anything, smaller sites have more to gain from HTTP/2 and HTTP/3 than the likes of Google. For example:

- Both HTTP/2 and HTTP/3 seek to reduce the number of round trips, mitigating latency between the user and the server. Now, from Google's perspective, the "server" is the nearest load balancer in a globally distributed network, which is probably geographically close to wherever the user is. Thus, users with good Internet connections typically have low enough latency for the improvements not to matter much. But Google still cares about latency because of users with poor internet connections – such as anyone on a cell network in a spotty coverage area. Well, poor connections affect all sites equally. But small sites tend to not be fully distributed; they probably only have a single origin server for application logic, and perhaps a single server period, if they're not using a CDN. That means a fixed geographic location, which will have higher latency to users farther away even if they have a good connection – thus more benefit from latency mitigation.

- QUIC can send stream data in the first packet sent to the server, without having to go through a SYN/ACK handshake first. TCP Fast Open lets plain old TCP do the same thing – but only when connecting to a server you've seen in the recent past (and retrieved an authentication tag from). Thus, QUIC is faster when connecting to a server for the first time – which affects smaller sites a lot more than Google.


Most users of HTTP have never been too concerned with it's overhead

End users complain all the time about latency. And that includes the latency to your small website hosted on a single server hundreds of milliseconds from your visitor... certainly more than it includes google's websites.

What you really mean is that small website operators generally don't care that their visitors are irritated by how slow their website is... and just brush it off and ignore it because they have no solution to the problem.

Maybe you should consider h2 as being for the benefit of visitors across the internet, and a benefit for those who care about performance.

It says it all that even though h2 is not required, small website have adopted it across the globe... now at 1/3rd of all websites, and growing.


I don't think cloudfare really does traffic analysis. At least nowhere near the level that google does. It is not their core business.


Why then they offer free fully functional CDN-like service, free SSL ? Data is new oil, and CF has all data in plaintext - your logins/passwords included.


Because...

a. It's really cheap for us to offer that service

b. Lots of those free customers end up upgrading, paying for extras, etc.

Between a and b offering the free service makes sense. We make money from the customers who pay us for our service (https://www.cloudflare.com/plans/), not from doing something nefarious with data. We'd be shooting ourselves in the foot if we did because that data is our customers data. We need to be very careful with that or we'd lose trust and not be in business.

Also, free means anybody can try the service and kick the tires. Often those people turn out to me the CIO, CSO, CISO, CTO, ... of big corp.


The plaintext thing is just too sensitive, and your free service offer makes the reach too wide. Could you be compelled, by warrant, to provide all plaintext traffic from a single user IP?




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