I think your response is a bit narrow and takes my response out of context. It also ignores a number of other issues to make electric cars look better than they really are.
1. Electric cars use a lot of copper and lithium. Mining of both are horribly polluting. The worst EPA superfund site is a former copper mine. Lithium mining is also pretty bad. However they are at least localized.
Electric cars still need power, most of which still comes from carbon emitting sources. Until the world switches to renewables, electric cars still generate carbon indirectly. California and other areas are much better about this but Tesla Model 3 customers don't all live in CA.
2. I was trying to answer the initial question from the perspective of a potential customer of the Model 3. If someone is as passionate about the carbon emitting issue as you, they can already do that with Nissan Leaf, BMW i3, or Chevy Volt. They don't need to wait nor pay more for the the Tesla Model 3. So within that context, the other things that make BM3 3-series what it is matters. These things include the interior, etc.
3. BMW already do updates over the air but not nearly at the rate that Tesla does. Tesla really has embraced software whereas other carmakers treat it as an overhead. I really hate how Autopilot is presented. It's not really self-driving because they keep telling you to be involved in the driving process. Until they can confidently say it's completely autonomous, it's more of a novelty than an useful feature.
Edited: Kudos for being so passionate about the issue. It does matter to me and which is why I still haven't completely dismissed the Model 3 as a choice.
Hey thanks for the reply. Sounds like you've also thought quite a bit about this. I'd like to offer my thoughts on your numbered points.
For 1, you're right, we have to mine minerals to get these cars to work. I'm not really sure how much more polluting the production of Lithium and copper is compared to steel, but I assume it's bad. However in the long term I assume most of those polluting mining processes could be electric, could they not? The point is that long term you could make mining those minerals completely clean.
For 2, you're right there are plenty of electric cars you can buy right now. And obviously Tesla interiors aren't terrific, we all know that. The main reason I would choose Tesla is that EVs are their bread and butter. Chevy and Nissan have an interest in keeping ICE cars going, so supporting them doesn't align with the goal of making all cars electric long term.
For 3, you pretty much hit the nail on the head with Tesla being a software company where other companies see software as a cost center. As far as the autopilot goes, you should cut Tesla a little bit of slack, because while their software is not true-to-the-name autopilot, they are also limited by regulators with how much freedom they can give the driver to rely on the software. So in many places where autopilot falls short of being true autopilot, it's likely due to regulators holding them back.
So that's my take on things. I'm in my early 20s, and I take you to be a gen Xer. You know, as an aside, I am really disheartened by Gen X's lack of passion for climate change, no offense to you. I love HackerNews but I get a little sad when I see people blow it off. I strongly believe that how we handle this climate disaster will define humanity's fate in the 21st century, but coming here people seem very relaxed about the whole thing. Oh well. Cheers.
Haha. Not really, I'm actually a millenial (on the older end of the spectrum though). I can see what you may think I'm Gen X though. It may surprise you to know that I'm actually an environmentalist as well. I was definitely more active and passionate about it when I was younger. Time and other priorities have dulled my passion over time -- regrettably.
To be fair on #1, even considering the entire supply chain and lifecycle of an EV vs ICE, the EV comes out WAY ahead of the ICE in terms of carbon impact. Even better if you have solar panels on your roof, or live in a place like California that has a significant amount of renewables in the main grid.
As someone who uses the autopilot v1 constantly, for me it really isn't a novelty feature. Driving 6-7 hours on motorway/highway, the car drives 80-90% of the way. Yes, I have to pay attention and supervise the car, but I am definitely less tired at the end of the drive.
That's a really good insight. Having never experienced that, I would have never imagined how the middle ground between full attention and complete autonomous driving could be a good place. That's definitely something for me to keep in mind.
1. Electric cars use a lot of copper and lithium. Mining of both are horribly polluting. The worst EPA superfund site is a former copper mine. Lithium mining is also pretty bad. However they are at least localized.
Electric cars still need power, most of which still comes from carbon emitting sources. Until the world switches to renewables, electric cars still generate carbon indirectly. California and other areas are much better about this but Tesla Model 3 customers don't all live in CA.
2. I was trying to answer the initial question from the perspective of a potential customer of the Model 3. If someone is as passionate about the carbon emitting issue as you, they can already do that with Nissan Leaf, BMW i3, or Chevy Volt. They don't need to wait nor pay more for the the Tesla Model 3. So within that context, the other things that make BM3 3-series what it is matters. These things include the interior, etc.
3. BMW already do updates over the air but not nearly at the rate that Tesla does. Tesla really has embraced software whereas other carmakers treat it as an overhead. I really hate how Autopilot is presented. It's not really self-driving because they keep telling you to be involved in the driving process. Until they can confidently say it's completely autonomous, it's more of a novelty than an useful feature.
Edited: Kudos for being so passionate about the issue. It does matter to me and which is why I still haven't completely dismissed the Model 3 as a choice.